SureAI

edit: I just noticed, the numbskull that I am, that this wouldn't be the best place for this sort of thing. I'll post this in the Nehrim forum instead of the general SureAI one. Sorry about that, this can be deleted if any mods come across it. (here it is: http://www.sureai.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=3207 )

Hi, just registered to write a few words on what disappointed me, or rather what I was expecting and didn't get. I'll try not to turn it into a whine-fest. Especially as what I've seen and heard was very impressive.

I got as far as the Abbey at the moment and I'm level 3 or so. Not far, admittedly, but I doubt game mechanics will magically change later on.

See, I'm one of those players who are slightly OCD about certain game mechanics. I pretty much discarded Oblivion because of the progression and leveling system, which is realistic only in theory. Kill things with a sword and get better at it, make potions to be a master alchemist and so on. Once I noticed that you pretty much have to abuse the system to get the most out of your stats (the silly "raise these skills 5 times before leveling or you might not be powerful enough by the end of the game because you get one point in strength instead of five" mechanic) I found it next to impossible to just immerse myself in the game and play normally.

"Play normally" as opposed to "stand like a knob blocking rats to level blocking", "jump like a loon all over the place to become an acrobat", "constantly cast a healing spell to max that willpower before leveling" or my personal favorite "sneak back and forth in a room full of friendlies for an hour to level agility".

Whenever I looked, Nehrim sounded like the perfect solution. Advertised to resemble Gothic (I *love* me some Gothic), introduce a balanced leveling system (classic experience points, finally!) and do away with the silly broken vanilla Oblivion constant mathematics.

Much to my dismay, the whole system remained almost intact, minus the major-minor skills. The readme tells me that the "natural" progression of skills has been severely slowed down, to the point of having to rely on trainers, but I found that to be untrue. The experience points actually make it worse, because I'm now hesitant to explore, as I might come across an enemy that makes me level up, and I still haven't sneaked around the friendly tavern enough to get the full 5 points of agility I deserve and feel I would be gimped without. There were a couple of mods for Oblivion that substituted natural progression for exp points, but I found them to be unbalanced. I had really hoped Nehrim would be the remedy to that.

The tl;dr version:
Nehrim looks and sounds stunning, but keeps the old broken Oblivion skills and stats progression system in spite of introducing experience points, which makes me very sad. No matter how beautiful or well-voiceacted the world is, I just can't get into it when I have to think about maxing out my stats before killing that last rat.

Anyone agree?

Had you played the game little more you would have realised that getting +5 every lvl isnt necessary.

yeah,,, you're making the assumption that is will be oblivion, while makin the assumption that it won't.. the hell man? listen, since you did not give it more than 1-2 hours of gameplay before you complain ill explain it to you short.

just leveling normally and getting+1-+3 in stats you trained is more then enough... i've never bothered to make the game a grind feast as i don't have to, there is no stat requirements, and i assume stats are still capped at 100... what you are doing is wasting a lot of time, making sure you will be over powered and cruise through the game... i'm kinda tempted to be rude and call you names but i won't... play normally and you will have an enjoyable experience, unlike what you're having now. grinding is not fun, and being far too strong and loosing the interest in getting strongger because you own everything anyways... is both a good way to ruin your experience... and this is exactly what you are doing.

*insert personal insult to intelligence here*

I am up to level 8 now, and have I have been playing normally, as you describe the way you would call normally. The stats have only gone up +1, +2 or +3 at a time. I have not noticed this being an issue at all, yet I have noticed many differences from vanilla Oblivion such that just playing it as a RPG is much easier, so this is more of an RPG than a skill acquisition fest Oblivion was.

Give it some more time, travel to Giliad, then to the Sanctum. Play it as a RPG instead of worrying about skills, unless there is a skill you really need for you to RPG the role of your character.

Guys guys guys. You seem to be missing the "ocd" bit of my post. I KNOW it's not fun to grind for stats, it's retarded. I really DON'T want to do that. But hey, the mechanic is there, and it's really hard for me not to think about it.

I'm perfectly aware that I can't expect a level of polish of a full product from a free mod. I'm just stating what keeps me from enjoying the loveliness.

The character progression system is a huge part of any RPG with any numbers in it. Oblivion and Nehrim have lots and lots of numbers. Telling me just to ignore it and play normally is fair, I guess, but you can't deny that one of the fundamental RPG mechanics of this otherwise good mod is broken.

It's a good thing the authors are aware of it. I'll play around with it a bit more and see if I can "ignore" it. If not, I'll just amuse myself with other things and wait for either a proper update or a balanced and polished mod (for a mod )

Also, good thing you refrained from calling me names, TrexTitan. Hardly a situation to call anybody any names, eh?

No... it is not broken by any means... the problem occured and resides within the boundaries of your imagination here... the game allows you to choose, grind for 3 hours to get +5 in your preffered stats and own the mobs of your own level, and then take on stronger mobs 10 levels too early... or play somewhat normally and enjoy the ride. it is not broken just because it does not force you to grind... in oblivion, where enemies would always be a challenge since they scaled to your level, you had to be STRONG for your level... in Nehrim this is not an issue... a mob too strong? well duh... he's lvl 25 and you're lvl 12... mob too weak? well yeah you're lvl 25 and it is lvl 8... if you play the game somewhat normally, not making grinding a focal point which it was and HAD to be in oblivion, you will do ok.

so in conclusion, you assume it is like oblivion and you have to grind, but it is not, you do not have to grind. and if... for some reason you must grind, then thats just you being the dear special kid at school... No one else have so far felt the need to grind to be able to keep up with the game's story/quests/sidequests/mobs.