SureAI

!st : not informing that the 8gb file is almost a full version, over half a year and over half a gb out of date is not friendly. While the the download instructions say "update" the wording implies in future and does not say mandatory.
2nd putting a version as primary download that won't run out of the box without a forced update is seriously unprofessional
3rd forcing the update through a propriety launcher really hurts when you have a capped data connection as their only option especially when you have a desktop. (what should I do drag my tower into McDonald's ?) It also bodes ill for the long term playability of the mod. No point in archiving this one, it won't be playable once the server is gone.

The really sad part is it is so easy to fix.
You could update the distribution.
You could allow the patches to be sideloaded.
You could just remove the forced update and let me choose to play as is.

Don't become another Interplay, you're better than that.

huh, I have no idea what you're talking about
- I never had a forced update
- and surely never one of 8gb - the last really large one was 500mb

are you sure the launcher didn't reload the whole game for some reason?
(installation corrupt or something?)

The current overall update size is 900 MB and it will grow. We will repack the installation file with all updates once the "Forgotten Stories "-DLC/Addon is released. Maybe you should wait for that.

I can't see a problem, it isn't our fault that you have a capped data connection.
I quote from our page on the Nexus: You need to patch at least one time to be able to play because the 8GB files were a preload (= pre release download). Needless to say that it is not unprofessional to put a 8GB main file up. Have you got Steam, Uplay, Origin? - Updates are always forced.
And the reason why updates are mandotory is that you don't want bug reports for already fixed problems.
Furthermore, would you like to download 8GB after every patch if we would only update the main files on e.g the Nexus, Moddb, torrent?

The main file will get two updates, one once the Forgotten Stories DLC is released, and a second update as soon as we won't update Enderal anymore, so everybody is able to play it.
And it is not "easy to fix" (whatever this means) as you may have noticed.

So, I would recommend the same as Hoxyd. You should wait for a updated main file but don't report any bugs if you won't update.

@urst the main download is 8gb which is large for a mod that also requires a day one patch just to run. Hence-> forced update.

@Tillboy
Quoting from the nexus is all fine and well but I didn't download it from the nexus I downloaded from your main site. Which says nothing of the kind.

Its not your fault broadband isn't available where I live however you did conciously choose not to offer a choice to me or the other 60% of the planet that doesn't have broadband as an available option.

It's unprofessional to put up that large a file that won't run on it's own and never update it. I've downloaded plenty of huge mods and never seen one that refused to run because the only version posted was outdated. As a pre-release fine but that was over six months ago the file could have been updated by now or you could just put a third link with a current patch bundle to just be streamlined into the install. Just like Microsoft lets you put the service packs in to be streamlined into a windows install so you don't have to have update run a couple hundred times right off the bat.

I don't have uplay or origin and I installed and ran steam precisely once to get skyrim installed and Its been in offline mode ever since. I buy my games retail or through gog for exactly that reason.

No i don't have a problem with updates, and no i don't want to redownload 8gb every patch. You misunderstood me, what I suggest is an easy fix. The launcher downloads a patch file and applies it. All that needs to be done offer a link to the file, a folder to place it in the launchers directory, then have the launcher look for it locally and apply it just as it would have before. Thus one can download it where and when able to be used anywhere.
One dynamically generated Link to patch bundle on website.
If local file matches current patch
Then install
Else download patch
in whatever style you feel accomplishes that most efficiently.

Whether you do or not is inconsequential to me. I can wait for a final version just as easily. If I come off as hostile or belligerent it is not intentionally directed at you per se. This current trend of thinking in software development that always online is the ONLY way to get things done; despite a couple of decades of doing just fine without it, really irritates me. A good deal of this generation's software will be lost due to this practice; which is a wholly avoidable situation.

I have read and heard nothing but good things about your overall talent for game design (as a team). Please know that I respect and hold in high regard the principles on which you base your mods. Gothic and its ilk are some of the games I most enjoy and respect the design choices of. Nor will any if this color my view of your work. I simply disagree with your distribution choices.

Regards.

The installation instruction is pretty much straight forward and lets you know that you have to download the patches. Are you really arguing about the wording? As I said, it will be updated twice in the future. Furthermore there is a little more to the installation and updates as you may think. It is not a "08/15" mod.
Are you really comparing us to Microsoft? That's a little off, don't you think - Comparing ten thousands employees to a hand full of people in their sparetime. This is why the update system exists. We did offer manual patches back with Nehrim, users only had issues with it and we had constantly reports because of it. There won't be manual updates. You know, we have to do it because we have to make sure that your Skyrim is a legal copy (Steam must be running etc.). There is no other way to ensure this.

As I said, it's your mod, how you choose to distribute it is up to you. We agree to disagree on that point.

Only two other things and I shall withdraw.
First, you mention that you offered manual patching with Nehrim, but some couldn't use it and thus it was withdrawn. I understand where you're coming from. However over time as we continue to remove choice and make things "easier " what we really do is make people less competent. As it stands now almost no one understands how the technology they use on a daily basis even functions. I see this every day in my job. I restore vintage (40s and below) motorcycles, but I have to be very selective who I sell them to because people don't understand anymore that the idea of a machine that runs day in and day out with no maintenance or attention is really only something that has come about in the last couple decades. If I sell such a bike to such a person they're back within the month and have completely destroyed it. This is a trend of thinking which could be reversed, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.

The second point is just something I found amusing in your reply. You state that you must verify the copy is legitimate. I assume this is because your mod is a full conversion ? I know none of my other skyrim mods have any kind of code to verify such things.

Best of luck in your future endeavours.

Enderal copies several (all?) bsa of Skyrim, of course it needs to ensure your copy is legitimate.
Other mods usually insert an esp/bsa/esm into the data folder instead of making copies.

SureAI are a team with well over ten years of experience. you can assume that
they made the whole download/installation/update process as smooth and accessible for as many people as possible.

This gets a little off topic but I don't see this as a disadvantage but rather as an advantage. Also this process is completely natural: Things get simplified over time, otherwise we would still live in caves, it's a part of human evolution and development. You have to be a genius to understand everything around you. I bet that your don't care how a washing machine or scanner in detail works for example. They just have to work if you click on the start button, you don't want to be bothered with it because your head is full of other things. You specialize yourself in a certain topic, so that other people get an advantage of your knowledge/skills. That's how society works.^^
And coming back to the topic: some people don't like to get bothered with a patching process of a game - they just want to play. As a consequence, the process gets simplified in a way that is comfortable for the most of the users. All BSAs and modified .esm. Bethesda and (especially) Germany has some really strict rules you have to follow regarding the whole copyright stuff.

Actually I do know, and care, how my washing machine and scanner works. They are devices I rely on for day in day out use, therefore it is necessary for me understand them to ensure they continue to function properly. It's funny you mention washers in particular as mine broke last month and owing to the fact I do not subscribe to willful ignorance of the world around me I was able to repair it for $18 and 15 minutes of my time rather than buy a whole new machine or pay for a service call. What you describe is not progress, it is steady decay fed by apathy and complacency.

You don't need to be a genius, you just need to spend a little time reading a manual. Overspecializing generally leads to extinction.